PhantomDeejay
1. No-one is going to take your forum privileges away.
2. Help has always been provided to those who ask for it.
Now, the whole thing started because repeatedly you have said that there's no logic, or that is against logic to have the waves move like this.
We tried to prove you that there is logic for SEVERAL reasons.
We don't argue the fact that you don't like this logic and you have a different view on things...
But your wording was as if we are all wrong. And that's like accusing us that we didn't think of it when we implemented the waves to move this way.
I believe we have proved that there is a lot of logic behind the direction of the waveforms.
We DO respect your view and your wish, but that's a different story as I already told you some posts ago.
What you ask for may or may not come in the future. The devs have heard you, and there's no point to argue any further. If they decide to bring the option back I'm sure you'll notice it right away :)
I hope we can all calm down now...
PS: At some point this thread went completely the wrong way... I would like to please all of you to NOT make it personal and avoid flaming... We don't like to lock threads, and we wouldn't want to lock this one either.
Thank you!
2. Help has always been provided to those who ask for it.
Now, the whole thing started because repeatedly you have said that there's no logic, or that is against logic to have the waves move like this.
We tried to prove you that there is logic for SEVERAL reasons.
We don't argue the fact that you don't like this logic and you have a different view on things...
But your wording was as if we are all wrong. And that's like accusing us that we didn't think of it when we implemented the waves to move this way.
I believe we have proved that there is a lot of logic behind the direction of the waveforms.
We DO respect your view and your wish, but that's a different story as I already told you some posts ago.
What you ask for may or may not come in the future. The devs have heard you, and there's no point to argue any further. If they decide to bring the option back I'm sure you'll notice it right away :)
I hope we can all calm down now...
PS: At some point this thread went completely the wrong way... I would like to please all of you to NOT make it personal and avoid flaming... We don't like to lock threads, and we wouldn't want to lock this one either.
Thank you!
Posted Wed 11 Mar 15 @ 3:29 pm
Richmond
PhantomDeejay wrote :
2. Help has always been provided to those who ask for it.
George, like I said; I don't expect you guys to ever actually admit that you are wrong about this. I could go on and on with classic proofs to support my argument. But my time is very expensive, and it is totally pointless to present evidence to a jury whose mind is already made up beforehand (hence the term "prejudiced").
On the other-hand, You say that help is always provided to anyone who asks. Well I would hope so.., but also, I assume you are inferring that to be true, no matter how POd the staff might be toward that particular individual at the given moment? Indeed, and if so, since I know you will see this as you are actively monitoring this thread ...would you please have someone address this unanswered help request, http://www.virtualdj.com/forums/199165/PC_Version_Technical_Support/Program_apparently_clashes_with_video_cards_.html which is almost two days old? If possible, I'd really like to get this resolved before you all take off for the weekend.
Thank you.
Posted Thu 12 Mar 15 @ 2:37 pm
djjohnnyrox
Heres a little fuel for the fire
http://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming/new-research-reveals-why-video-games-scroll-from-left-to-right/
http://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming/new-research-reveals-why-video-games-scroll-from-left-to-right/
Posted Sun 15 Mar 15 @ 7:02 pm
Richmond
djjohnnyrox wrote :
Heres a little fuel for the fire
http://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming/new-research-reveals-why-video-games-scroll-from-left-to-right/
http://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming/new-research-reveals-why-video-games-scroll-from-left-to-right/
Interesting.
Since we've been having this discussion, I decided to put my assertions to test, and really see what other people who had not been exposed to these programs before, would say about it.
So I took a screenshot of the upper part of the VDJ5 GUI, which depicts two complete turntables in the classic position, along with all the waveforms. I edited out the VDJ logos, printed out the copy, and so far I've presented it to 28 people to-date. I chose subjects who had experience with TTs/record-players, but no audio software experience. I tried very hard not to influence their decisions in any way.
I told them all the same thing, and asked them all the same question: "The waveform in the upper display represents the record groove passing under the needle as the record turns. What is the proper or most intuitive direction for the waveform to travel?"
So far, the response has been unanimous, and without hesitation: "left-to-right".
Well, so much for the "1% of the population whose brain is wired differently" theory... Anyone who doubts this, should try it for themself.
Posted Sun 15 Mar 15 @ 9:29 pm
discobrian24
Ok let me ask you a question. If the waves moved in the direction you are seeking, how can you look ahead at "future Cues", and other Points of Interest?? English people read Left To Right so that means the wave has to move Right to Left to read correct??
Posted Mon 16 Mar 15 @ 1:34 am
locoDog
Don't bother it a circular argument
Posted Mon 16 Mar 15 @ 2:06 am
Adion
It would be interesting to ask them to point out on the screen shot which part they think will be coming up next. (For example with a part with a break/no beats on one side and beats on the other)
The article about video games calls it left-to-right scrolling in video games for example because it appears the character is moving over the world from left-to-right.
Looking closer to what's really happening is that our current focus (be it the video game character or the needle) is stationary, and the background is moving from right-to-left, giving the illusion of movement of from left to right.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kcmKPmj9yeE
The article about video games calls it left-to-right scrolling in video games for example because it appears the character is moving over the world from left-to-right.
Looking closer to what's really happening is that our current focus (be it the video game character or the needle) is stationary, and the background is moving from right-to-left, giving the illusion of movement of from left to right.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kcmKPmj9yeE
Posted Mon 16 Mar 15 @ 2:54 am
Fruit
Please excuse me for posting my 2 cents, I don't want to get into that direction controversy.
But a feature present in past versions, should still be there. Well, that's all folks :)
But a feature present in past versions, should still be there. Well, that's all folks :)
Posted Mon 16 Mar 15 @ 11:10 am
Fruit
Also, a little peacefull post :)
As loco said, it doesn't matter... Why ? Because it is circular...
To get further, in my opinion it all depends of the point of view.
1) Center of jogwheel POV
Well, we're in the case Richmond describes... If your POV is the center of the record and you look at the needle, you can turn your turntable in the direction you want (even with the needle being below the center of the record), it is a fact that the unplayed is at the left of the needle, and the played at its right.
2) External POV
Let's say it's the dj's POV, away from the turntable. This case is exactly what Phantom described with his picture. If the needle points BELOW the center of the record (as in Phantoms pics) we can obiously say the unplayed is at the right, and the played at the left. BUT, with that particularity that, if you rotate the turntable on the Phantom's picture by 180° so that the needle is ABOVE the center of the record, THEN the reading is inversed : unplayed left, played right.
I hope I made my thoughts clear. So both you all are right, it all depends of what POV you want to take.
As loco said, it doesn't matter... Why ? Because it is circular...
To get further, in my opinion it all depends of the point of view.
1) Center of jogwheel POV
Well, we're in the case Richmond describes... If your POV is the center of the record and you look at the needle, you can turn your turntable in the direction you want (even with the needle being below the center of the record), it is a fact that the unplayed is at the left of the needle, and the played at its right.
2) External POV
Let's say it's the dj's POV, away from the turntable. This case is exactly what Phantom described with his picture. If the needle points BELOW the center of the record (as in Phantoms pics) we can obiously say the unplayed is at the right, and the played at the left. BUT, with that particularity that, if you rotate the turntable on the Phantom's picture by 180° so that the needle is ABOVE the center of the record, THEN the reading is inversed : unplayed left, played right.
I hope I made my thoughts clear. So both you all are right, it all depends of what POV you want to take.
Posted Mon 16 Mar 15 @ 11:31 am
Richmond
Adion wrote :
It would be interesting to ask them to point out on the screen shot which part they think will be coming up next. (For example with a part with a break/no beats on one side and beats on the other)
I have asked them questions like that after their initial answer. For example, a lot of people don't actually say "left-to-right" ...they just point across the display toward the right side, and say "that way". So, although I already know what they mean, I will pin them down to an more exact answer, by asking questions like: "If this line here represent the needle, or the "now", as it were... which side should be the played, and which, the unplayed?"
You have to be careful what sort of questions you ask them, as some people get confused very easily, but the answer has always come out the same, so far. As I say... you should try it yourself.
Posted Mon 16 Mar 15 @ 5:52 pm
raypitman
"you can please all of the people some of the time, some of the people all of the time etc. etc.etc."
please do not change the way that this works as it is now, just because one man wants it to be otherwise!
please do not change the way that this works as it is now, just because one man wants it to be otherwise!
Posted Mon 16 Mar 15 @ 7:19 pm
Richmond
discobrian24 wrote :
Ok let me ask you a question. If the waves moved in the direction you are seeking, how can you look ahead at "future Cues", and other Points of Interest??
Assuming you are being serious, you apparently don't really understand what we are talking about here. No view, or information in the views, is being gained, nor lost... Just the two sides are swapped left for right. A 'mirror image', if you will. Also, the feature already exists in V7. Just choose that option in settings, and you can see for yourself how it works.
discobrian24 wrote :
English people read Left To Right so that means the wave has to move Right to Left to read correct??
Again... this has nothing to do with "reading". Please study the entire thread, if you really would like to understand the issue. It has already been explained very thoroughly.
Posted Mon 16 Mar 15 @ 8:53 pm
locoDog
Posted Mon 16 Mar 15 @ 9:07 pm
Richmond
Fruit wrote :
1) Center of jogwheel POV
Well, we're in the case Richmond describes... If your POV is the center of the record and you look at the needle, you can turn your turntable in the direction you want (even with the needle being below the center of the record), it is a fact that the unplayed is at the left of the needle, and the played at its right.
2) External POV
Let's say it's the dj's POV, away from the turntable. This case is exactly what Phantom described with his picture. If the needle points BELOW the center of the record (as in Phantoms pics) we can obiously say the unplayed is at the right, and the played at the left. BUT, with that particularity that, if you rotate the turntable on the Phantom's picture by 180° so that the needle is ABOVE the center of the record, THEN the reading is inversed : unplayed left, played right.
Well, we're in the case Richmond describes... If your POV is the center of the record and you look at the needle, you can turn your turntable in the direction you want (even with the needle being below the center of the record), it is a fact that the unplayed is at the left of the needle, and the played at its right.
2) External POV
Let's say it's the dj's POV, away from the turntable. This case is exactly what Phantom described with his picture. If the needle points BELOW the center of the record (as in Phantoms pics) we can obiously say the unplayed is at the right, and the played at the left. BUT, with that particularity that, if you rotate the turntable on the Phantom's picture by 180° so that the needle is ABOVE the center of the record, THEN the reading is inversed : unplayed left, played right.
Ah, how refreshing! At last... someone who actually understands, and can present a logical unbiased argument. :)
Posted Mon 16 Mar 15 @ 9:15 pm
PhantomDeejay
PhantomDeejay wrote :
It's a matter of perspective. It has always been!
Even when you look on a turntable... You see the needle stationary and the record move "clockwise"
"Clockwise" is the only word we all agree because it describes a circular movement.
However on waveforms we have to deal with a linear approach. You must "convert" the circular movement to linear.
Sure you can choose one way or another, depending on how you want to see things:
You can choose to see the reds or the blues...
It's a matter of perspective. It has always been!
Even when you look on a turntable... You see the needle stationary and the record move "clockwise"
"Clockwise" is the only word we all agree because it describes a circular movement.
However on waveforms we have to deal with a linear approach. You must "convert" the circular movement to linear.
Sure you can choose one way or another, depending on how you want to see things:
You can choose to see the reds or the blues...
Now, I'm not a native English speaker, but I believe the word "Perspective" means "point of view", right ?
Over and out!
Posted Wed 18 Mar 15 @ 1:55 pm
Fruit
Right, sir.
Posted Wed 18 Mar 15 @ 9:49 pm
Richmond
Ponder the error of your ways...
Posted Fri 20 Mar 15 @ 9:01 pm
locoDog
Back under your bridge with you.
Posted Fri 20 Mar 15 @ 9:18 pm
raypitman
@ Loco, how long do I have keep banging my head before it feels better when I stop doin it? LOL
@ Richmond, I can understand your point of view ... but I don't agree with it, and I'm too old to start changin things now.
just for the record; I like it as it is now, nothing and nobody is perfect, but VDJ8 is pretty damm close.
@ Richmond, I can understand your point of view ... but I don't agree with it, and I'm too old to start changin things now.
just for the record; I like it as it is now, nothing and nobody is perfect, but VDJ8 is pretty damm close.
Posted Sat 21 Mar 15 @ 10:52 am
Chreece
It would be easier if there was an option to choose the direction. That bugged me when i started using VDJ (starting playing videos, i shoulded give up playing with the common cd-player setup), but now i have been used to it. So it's not a big thing to give an option so everybody would be happy...
Posted Sat 21 Mar 15 @ 11:22 am
